'Not sure i completely agree, an online notice board can be unofficial. There can be only 1 'official' notice board that needs to be defined in NOR and SIs.
Ben, Re Sue, Perhaps you could explain your disagreement a little more.
Strictly within the context of the rrs.org Event Management System Paul's answer to your question that there is no functional differences between the 'Official Notice Board' and the 'Online Notice Board' was, of course quite right.
I think Sue was addressing the broader context of the RRS. Most events these days have some sort of online noticeboard. This is not necessarily the Official Notice Board. RRS J2.1(7) requires that the NOR or SI identify which or where is the Official Notice Board.
Let's be clear. My question was about the computer coding functionality of the two versions on racingrulesofsailing.org, not the RRS function.
Sue appears (as you say) to have commented on the RRS connotation, and I agree with her.
------------------------------ The phrase 'Official Notice Board' is not defined, but is used several times in the RRS in an ordinary sense.
61.1 - Race Committee Protests 86.2 - WS Authorisation letter for changes to rules in a specific event 87 - Permission to change class rules at an event 90.2 - Sailing Instructions location (J2.1(7) - Location of ONB) N1.7 - WS Authorisation Letter to adjust constitution of International Jury N1.8 - MNA approval of the International Jury (App. S - Example standard sailing instructions)
However J2.1(7) asks for the SI to define it's location, and that essentially defines it as 'the location for the information in referred to elsewhere'. So it doesn't need any special definition.
'Online Notice Board' is a remnant of the old days when ONBs were physical paper noticeboards, but backed up online. Now there seems to be cross-over in the uses of both.
The terminology here is pedantic. I think as per Appendix J, an 'Official Notice Board' should be referred to. Thus, the name online notice board is redundant when all comms are online anyway.
I think it's an omission not to specifically name an Official Notice Board.
I wonder about efficacy of "Official Notice Board" being an online system, particularly as relates to protests and protest notifications. Since "board" isn't in the RRS Definitions, I resorted to Webster's. Definition 1 says a "board" is a flat piece of wood with length greater than width. (New International, 2004 ed.); but my real problem is that online systems are basically "pull" and subject to internet outages, permanency, wet phones, variability between systems, etc. In contrast, physical notice boards are inherently "push," especially since they're usually located at or near the gangway to the harbor. I understand WS wanting to minimize unnecessary use of forestry resources, but it seems to me to be a beneficial use to ensure fairness between competitors. More resources are bound to be consumed in requests for redress than in hanging a few sheets of paper where everyone can see them. Also, RRS 60.2(b) uses the term "inform," which is proactive, and again, the intention of the Rules is clearly to push to the protestee.
I'm also concerned about the meanings of the word "deliver" and "in writing" in 60.3(a). Scrawling "Andy's boat protests Bobby's boat under Rule 10" on a club napkin and carrying it to The Room is clearly a valid protest. It's evidentiary and permanent. Sending an X or Instagram message does not constitute "in writing," is not permanent, and is not in any sense guaranteed to be delivered.
'Online Notice Board' is a remnant of the old days when ONBs were physical paper noticeboards, but backed up online. Now there seems to be cross-over in the uses of both.
Benjamin wrote: "'Online Notice Board' is a remnant of the old days when ONBs were physical paper noticeboards, but backed up online. Now there seems to be cross-over in the uses of both."
I beg to differ that it is a remnant. If the Rules Committee chose to distinguish them, it seems clear to me that they're different things entirely. J2.1(7)
'Online Notice Board' is a remnant of the old days when ONBs were physical paper noticeboards, but backed up online. Now there seems to be cross-over in the uses of both.
Benjamin wrote: "'Online Notice Board' is a remnant of the old days when ONBs were physical paper noticeboards, but backed up online. Now there seems to be cross-over in the uses of both."
I beg to differ that it is a remnant. If the Rules Committee chose to distinguish them, it seems clear to me that they're different things entirely. J2.1(7)
my real problem is that online systems are basically "pull" and subject to internet outages, permanency, wet phones, variability between systems, etc.
I think these concerns are really exaggerated.
The RRS, in particular RRS J2.1(7) specifically countenance the use of an online [electronic] notice board.
The drafters of the RRS are not some cutting edge 'tech bros' boosting electronic systems. I think we can take for granted that this inclusion was subject to very mature and protracted debate addressing Kenneth's concerns before approval.
More resources are bound to be consumed in requests for redress than in hanging a few sheets of paper where everyone can see them.
' hanging a few sheets of paper where everyone can see them' is not an Official Notice Board, it's an unprofessional mess.
I'd suggest that Kenneth has never had the rewarding and educational experience of being a Jury Secretary at a busy regatta.
Maintaining the Official Notice Board up to date, from about half an hour before end of racing to end of protest hearings was a full time job for at least one person.
Perhaps you could explain your disagreement a little more.
My question was really only pertaining to the 'function' (say, the 'computer code behind the webpages') rather than the RRS 'officialness' of ithem.
I think Paul answered my query.
B
Strictly within the context of the rrs.org Event Management System Paul's answer to your question that there is no functional differences between the 'Official Notice Board' and the 'Online Notice Board' was, of course quite right.
I think Sue was addressing the broader context of the RRS. Most events these days have some sort of online noticeboard. This is not necessarily the Official Notice Board. RRS J2.1(7) requires that the NOR or SI identify which or where is the Official Notice Board.
Let's be clear. My question was about the computer coding functionality of the two versions on racingrulesofsailing.org, not the RRS function.
Sue appears (as you say) to have commented on the RRS connotation, and I agree with her.
------------------------------
The phrase 'Official Notice Board' is not defined, but is used several times in the RRS in an ordinary sense.
61.1 - Race Committee Protests
86.2 - WS Authorisation letter for changes to rules in a specific event
87 - Permission to change class rules at an event
90.2 - Sailing Instructions location
(J2.1(7) - Location of ONB)
N1.7 - WS Authorisation Letter to adjust constitution of International Jury
N1.8 - MNA approval of the International Jury
(App. S - Example standard sailing instructions)
However J2.1(7) asks for the SI to define it's location, and that essentially defines it as 'the location for the information in referred to elsewhere'. So it doesn't need any special definition.
'Online Notice Board' is a remnant of the old days when ONBs were physical paper noticeboards, but backed up online. Now there seems to be cross-over in the uses of both.
The terminology here is pedantic. I think as per Appendix J, an 'Official Notice Board' should be referred to. Thus, the name online notice board is redundant when all comms are online anyway.
I think it's an omission not to specifically name an Official Notice Board.
B
I'm also concerned about the meanings of the word "deliver" and "in writing" in 60.3(a). Scrawling "Andy's boat protests Bobby's boat under Rule 10" on a club napkin and carrying it to The Room is clearly a valid protest. It's evidentiary and permanent. Sending an X or Instagram message does not constitute "in writing," is not permanent, and is not in any sense guaranteed to be delivered.
Thoughts?
I beg to differ that it is a remnant. If the Rules Committee chose to distinguish them, it seems clear to me that they're different things entirely. J2.1(7)
I beg to differ that it is a remnant. If the Rules Committee chose to distinguish them, it seems clear to me that they're different things entirely. J2.1(7)
The RRS, in particular RRS J2.1(7) specifically countenance the use of an online [electronic] notice board.
The drafters of the RRS are not some cutting edge 'tech bros' boosting electronic systems. I think we can take for granted that this inclusion was subject to very mature and protracted debate addressing Kenneth's concerns before approval.
There's formal law in many countries that says that an electronic communication is a communication in writing.
I'd suggest that Kenneth has never had the rewarding and educational experience of being a Jury Secretary at a busy regatta.
Maintaining the Official Notice Board up to date, from about half an hour before end of racing to end of protest hearings was a full time job for at least one person.