14 (b) or RRS-2 for Red ?
Hi everybody !!
I think that in position N°2 if we have contact and no demage,
1°)
Blue breaks rule 10 and
2°)
Red breaks:
a) BASIC PRINCIPLES "SPORTSMANSHIP AND THE RULES"
b) rule 2 and
c) rule 3.3a
3.3 Acceptance of the rules includes agreement (a) to be governed by the rules;
What do you think about it ?
Thanks you !!!
Created: 20-Sep-09 11:57
If the contact was intentional, then RRS 2 may be applicable, but proving intent can be difficult. Was red yelling at blue (anything other than "starboard!")? That could be construed as bullying and/or intimidation which is a breach of RRS 2 (and possibly RRS 69.1(a)).
I agree with this that you have said:
Blue breaks RRS 10
Both break RRS 14 - but Red shall be exonerated RRS 14 (b).
2°)
Rule 14 says
"....avoid contact with another boat if reasonably possible."
I think that Red did nothing to avoid contact, that´s why i believe she breaks rule 2.
And as you know, rule 3 says
So i wonder, Red accepts rule 14 but was governed by it ?
If the scenario was changed slightly as follows, there might be an argument for rule 2:
Blue goes either up or down to get out of red’s way and red Responds by continuing to aim at blue’s transom possibly both 16 and 2 might apply.
Agree that that the following rules apply 10 and 14 (b). I prefer using the current rule 69 instead of rule 2 because then you can give a warning if there appears to be misbehavior, especially if red is known be a non-Corinthian sailor around the race course.
We are told no damage or injury so red is Exonerated for her breach of 14. It would be perverse to protest red for a breach of 2 or 69 on the grounds that she deliberately broke 14 when she is exonerated for that breach
In light of the stricter standard of proof required for protests under 2 or 69 (beyond reasonable doubt rather than balance of probability) a finding against red is most unlikely.
The proposal that Red’s reputation should influence proceedings is wrong. Any protest must deal only with the incident in question. If there have been incidents in the past which were not protested, then they should have been. Gossip about non Corinthian behaviour is little different to shouting do your turns but not protesting.
In this instance I think not.
DSQ both.
Consider
This is on on-water breach, with the outcome of the protest directly affecting the competition. Given that the possible breach of rule 2 or rule 69 is highly questionable (see Charles' argument about exoneration), this is not a 'serious' breach of rule 2, so one should not proceed to rule 69.
Judges can't choose the penalty they want to impose before hearing evidence and reaching conclusions on what rules are broken: that turns the process on its head.
And by the way, 'reputation' is not a consideration for a protest committee at any time, see also Charles' comment.
Charles Darley
Agree.
Agree
This isn't quite right.
I agree that breach of rule 2 will usually involve intent, and as Matt has said above, it is often difficult to establish intent clearly.
Agree.